Onisions Philosophy on Abortion.

[azile0 0]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mm1ek9uHil0&feature=user]Onisions Philosophy on Abortion.[/ame]

[Contract Killer 24]

I don't agree with alot of the things he says.

I think if you bring something into this world, it is YOUR responsibility, thus, i only believe in abortion in the cases of rape, and incest. You cannot just go around fucking, or getting fucked by everyone, and aborting a fetus, its just not right, its your on fault, and you need to live up to your wrongs you have done. If you cannot support the child, man up and know that you can't, accept it, and find a nice foster home. Now, I know children are sometimes treated like crap in foster homes, but look at it this way, once they turn 18, it is up to them to rule their life, make the right decisions, and work hard, where as if they would have just aborted the fetus, this wouldn't have happened.

This is not from a religious aspect, nor a political, I choose what I believe.

[Comp 0]

Wait...Christians don't still believe that there's a plan, do they? I read something that explained the difference...maybe it was some historical philosopher's opinion and I'm wrong, but it said that Christianity is supposed to believe that God doesn't have a plan for everything, but instead he's so experienced in life and whatnot as soon as someone is born God knows what's going to happen throughout its lifetime.

About abortion though...I don't believe or deny that there's souls, but he should realize that there's the potential for a human being in there; because that's what a fetus is. Not that there's some predetermined lifestyle the kid is going to live just because it was the child of someone who got raped or was an incompetent child, hopefully sooner or later everyone realizes outside of money life is what you make of it. True it will be hard and take some luck for the kid to grow up healthy, but I don't think that guy takes some of the stuff he takes seriously. Saying that someone is going to grow up to become a rapist because it's in their blood, whatever that means, is a pretty big guess. I wonder what he'd say about children that are accidents, the lucky few that broke through the condoms, I wonder if they should be aborted too by his standards.

As for the parent's of the rape or whatever...no comment there, really can't tell someone else what to do with their body. I just believe even if the pregnancy is brought on by some awful thing there's still a potential for a good person there, not that it's an automatic pain in the ass being born. I don't really have much to say about who takes care of the child...foster care is pretty bad, and so are incompetent parents; so the child will have a pretty big chance of a bad upbringing...but I still don't think that means the child will always turn out to be bad. It can be said that since you'll more likely wind up with a "bad" child than a "good" child it's better to abort to save the trouble of similar occurances happening in the next generation...but I just don't like the idea of making the few good suffer because of the many bad, it's hard to swallow.

[Bloodline 1]

Here's the thing I never got: people always say "there's a potential of life" or some mumbo-jumbo along the lines of "it could be the next Einstein". Einsteins aren't just born. Nor are Lennons or Boschs or Dalis or even Hitlers. They are nurtured. Your life and what you do with it isn't determined at birth. It's determined by the millions of events, small and big, that occur throughout your life. If a fetus is aborted, that implies the parent was unfit to care for it, be it financially or mentally. Sure a few of the world's geniuses and great artists came from complete shit, but that's nothing compared to the vast majority of felons and murderers that came from complete shit.

And then there's the people that say that pregnant women who want to abort should just birth the baby and give it up for adoption. Yeah, that's what we need; more children in the system. Most foster homes already have way too many kids for the workers to care for. A lot of those kids wind up abused, malnourished, or even getting involved with gang related activity (as they grow older of course). Or what about the kids that are adopted just so the parents will have that little bit of extra income from the state to support a drug habit, leaving the kid in an even worse position than before. Is that what we need? More kids growing up in poverty, surrounded by drugs? Is that going to spawn genius? Or rather, will that spawn enough genius to make up for the countless criminals and deviants that spawn from the very same situation.

Think of it this way: the legalization or gov't funding of abortion isn't making fit parents get rid of their spawn, it's enabling the poor, the addicted, the maniacal, or simply the unfit to painlessly prevent birthing a child that will just fall into plunder. By banning abortion, you are forcing all those people that desperately want or NEED to prevent birth to seek other methods of "dealing with it". Whether it be intentional miscarriage through self-induced injury, using drugs during pregnancy, or putting the newborn baby into a damn near corrupt system.

Additionally, those fetuses aren't just being tossed away like trash. A lot of the embryos, umbilical cords, and placentas are used for stem cell research, which saves lives. When you cut the funding of abortion, you are not only condemning countless future children to a life of misery, but people who suffer from neurological damage, spine injury, an numerous other disorders as well.

[GodzillA 0]

I will not abort any of my childrens <3

I don't give a shit what anyone else does, may many hills of aborted fetuses be the next renewable energy source for all I care.

Basically what I am saying, it isn't my job to apply my morals on anyone else.

[Comp 0]

Bloodline that works both ways...you also have to be nurtured into being a rapist, druggie, ect. There's a higher chance of that happening given the child's bad parents or foster care, but saying that's what they'll be because of their birthing situation is a huge assumption. If that child gets lucky and is surrounded by good, intelligent people growing up in foster care (lulz rarity) he's got a good chance of making something of himself, in my opinion at least. I understand most of those places are real hellholes but saying a child is fucked just because he was born into a place like that will never sit right with me. I'm not saying abortion is evil...I never bother to pick a side because it's pretty impossible to do so (life vs free will, that's how I see it anyway) however I am saying giving that child in foster care or with bad parents a predetermined "bad" person sentence isn't right. Sometimes it is better to have an abortion for financial/emotional reasons, I agree with that no doubt; but to ignore the potential of a fetus growing into a decent human being is a really fucked up thing to do, even if the chances are against it.

Also I had no idea that a lot of aborted fetuses go into stem cell research...I never really gave any thought to where they come from, that's interesting.

[Bloodline 1]

I wasn't saying that those situations guarantee a fucked up child. I simply meant the MAJORITY of kids raised in those environments reflect that negativity they were raised with when they are adults.

For example, my mother had me under some pretty extreme conditions. She was a 29 year old abused, single mother of 2 with an alcoholic, drug-addicted ex husband stalking her. I think she was the perfect candidate for raising children though, because she always put the lives of her children in front of her own. She had my oldest brother when she was 17, dropped out of high school and worked a full time and a part time job to take care of him. When my other brother was born when she was 20 years old, she left them in my grandparents care for a month while she worked 75 hours a week to make sure she could feed, clothe, and care for them in comfort when they returned to her care. When she had me, she entered RVCC (Raritan Valley Community College) and graduated magna cum laude with a degree in computer programming and business marketing. And despite an impoverished first few years (and the past 10 years), I'd say my mother did damn well in raising me. My oldest brother and I were/are good students with a hard work ethic (granted his work ethic is manual and mine digital lol), my oldest brother actually got a full Scholarship to major in Psychology at Rutgers University, which he turned down to go into the Carpenter's Union (he knew it was a bad decision when he made it, but he'd rather work his ass off for his money rather than slowly go insane from having to listen to other peoples problems all day).

My middle brother didn't turn out too well though, you can get a brief example of how retarded he is by reading my thread in the Pub about my absence.

So, for me to claim that people in poor financial / emotional situations should most likely get abortions was a bit hasty in hindsight, now that I think about, as long as somebody feels they have the proper tools and drive to ensure a secure living environment for their child, they have my full support in giving birth/raising the child.

[defqon 30]

Uh I see a big flame war coming.

[AnarchyX6942 0]

I think if a woman wants an abortion, she needs to do it in a back alley with a fucking coathanger or a baseball bat. Its fucking killing people, you cannot convince me otherwise, and by allowing it, we are not only making the youngest generations whores, but we're really teaching them irresponsibility.

[AnarchyX6942 0]

Fucking Double Post

[projectmayhem9 8]

I think if a woman wants an abortion, she needs to do it in a back alley with a fucking coathanger or a baseball bat. Its fucking killing people, you cannot convince me otherwise, and by allowing it, we are not only making the youngest generations whores, but we're really teaching them irresponsibility.

THere's the thing. When does the fetus become a person? Some say as soon as the sperm meets the egg, others don't.

I have mixed feelings about it. If you allow it, it helps people who are unfit to parent (as in sick, poor, etc. Not those to lazy to be a parent). But if you legalize it, abortion will be like the next birth control pill.

Either way someone is going to get screwed over. I don't know to much on the subject, but I do think there should be a limit on how long the fetus can be developed before having an abortion (i.e, 1 month and below you can have an abortion, over 1 month and it's not allowed).

[Comp 0]

Nice...that's one awesome mum. I totally agree with what you're saying blood.

Project I don't think there's any chance abortion will turn into the next pill...it's a lot more convenient to take a pill once a day than have an abortion and risk a lot of health complications.

[projectmayhem9 8]

Nice...that's one awesome mum. I totally agree with what you're saying blood.

Project I don't think there's any chance abortion will turn into the next pill...it's a lot more convenient to take a pill once a day than have an abortion and risk a lot of health complications.

And who's to say it wouldn't?

It could be the next pill as in, "Have sex without worrying about the possible side effects".

EDIT: Just watched the vid and I mostly agree with him.

[Comp 0]

Abortion has much worse side affects at a higher risk than the pill, and the pill is starting to relieve PMS symptoms. I can't see it becoming the next pill unless people like getting operated on and risking infertility on a regular basis...

[projectmayhem9 8]

Abortion has much worse side affects at a higher risk than the pill, and the pill is starting to relieve PMS symptoms. I can't see it becoming the next pill unless people like getting operated on and risking infertility on a regular basis...

As years pass, technology will advance.

[Bloodline 1]

well i highly doubt we're going to see a fetus-zapping ray in the near future lol.

And besides, an abortion is expensive as hell. My cousin paid for his exes abortion (not even his kid, but he knew the girl would wind up smoking the fetus to death if she didn't abort), it ran him 450 bucks. I doubt people are going to pay 450 for an abortion then deal with the one-month super-period that follows.

And I feel abortion is appropriate up until the 3 month mark, because before 3 months the fetus doesn't have an operational brain. Once the gears are turning, it's a human to me.

And thanks for the compliment towards my mom, Comp. Speaking of, my mother actually did have 2 abortions. The first abortion was when she was 25, the doctors said the baby would be born with severe liver dysfunction as well as heart and brain problems due to malformations in the womb and would most likely spend a good majority of its life in and out of hospitals, and would have severe mental handicaps. My mother felt it would be torturous to put a child through such agony so she had an abortion. Then again when she was 32, she was pregnant with what would have been my baby brother/sister, but it was an ectopic pregnancy, and either she or the baby would die during either pregnancy or delivery, so she was forced to abort and get a hysterectomy.

Now in cases like that, don't you think its acceptable to abort?

[Guest Fohacidal]

Im against abortions.

To put it simply I believe the only exceptions are during all kinds of rape, when something happens to the baby inside or if it risks the mothers life at childbirth.

Increasingly more and more young women are looking for ways to abort their babies or avoid pregnancy, and teen sex is definately on the rise. Even more interesting is the increasing NEGATIVE birth rates that are occuring around the world in countries such as England and Germany. (USA still has it positive, thanks to the latino population believe it or not)

[azile0 0]

I think that abortions may seem a little cruel, but now, let's change directions. What are your policies on stem-cell research? I am Pro-Stem Cell. This could be the cure to many crippling diseases, or even replace lost organs. We could provide fresh kidneys for those who need them. We could replace damaged brain tissue.

I think that stem-cells are the greatest medical possibility so far. And to get it, you harvest before the fetus has even begun to develop. I don't call that inhuman.

[Guest Fohacidal]

I think that abortions may seem a little cruel, but now, let's change directions. What are your policies on stem-cell research? I am Pro-Stem Cell. This could be the cure to many crippling diseases, or even replace lost organs. We could provide fresh kidneys for those who need them. We could replace damaged brain tissue.

I think that stem-cells are the greatest medical possibility so far. And to get it, you harvest before the fetus has even begun to develop. I don't call that inhuman.

Is this your attempt at trying to seem like the most politically/scientifically conscious person on these forums or something?

[bios 1]

The Male "pill" is being developed. Eventually I think we will be taking BC.

[Guest starscream]

The Male "pill" is being developed. Eventually I think we will be taking BC.

DEFFINITELY FINE by me. I get scared shitless about making a drunken mistake or even worse, some crazy bitch poking holes in the condom.. once they find out how eligible and desirable of a male I am, that is.

[Bloodline 1]

I think that abortions may seem a little cruel, but now, let's change directions. What are your policies on stem-cell research? I am Pro-Stem Cell. This could be the cure to many crippling diseases, or even replace lost organs. We could provide fresh kidneys for those who need them. We could replace damaged brain tissue.

I think that stem-cells are the greatest medical possibility so far. And to get it, you harvest before the fetus has even begun to develop. I don't call that inhuman.

Actually, fetuses aren't needed at all for stem cell research. You can harvest stem cells from the umbilical cord and the afterbirth, you can even harvest "adult" stem cells from skin tissue, though adult stem cells aren't nearly as adaptive.

The only reason fetal stem cells are still used is because they are simply most abundant in fetuses, the entire thing is basically a stem cell cluster.

And not only can stem cells cure crippling diseases or replace organs, though would be able to help countless disabled and/or paralyzed people like my mother who suffer from debilitating neck/spine injuries. It would repair the spinal column, strengthen the vertebrae, and even cushion the brain stem to prevent possible further brain injury.

Stem cells are literally a miracle cure, but it's religious fanatics like George Bush that prevent such miracles from happening, pretty ironic eh?

[Guest Fohacidal]

Stem cells are literally a miracle cure, but it's religious fanatics like George Bush that prevent such miracles from happening, pretty ironic eh?

That really ignorant of you to say, I back stem cell research and am a Roman Catholic...

[Contract Killer 24]

That really ignorant of you to say, I back stem cell research and am a Roman Catholic...

Same thing, I'm a lutheren, so is Oreo, actually, alot of people on the forums are religous, and they support it.

[Neur0 34]

Men shouldn't be allowed to make womens' decisions. As such, a baby is the woman's responsibility, thus my advocacy of pro-choice. Go ahead, call me a monster.

I am 100% for stem cell research as well.

I'm also non-religious.