Attention black people of sG

[Nitestalker 792]

Nigger is the only racial slur this clan seems to care about. We can rag on Jews, gays, Asians, Germans, trannies, literally anything else with no repercussions. The rule is stupid in that it is only enforced for nigger.

2. No and I wouldn't walk up to an 80lb white woman and call them a nigger either. But I would definitely use it casually in conversation to both parties, and have.

Also http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b48_1305790944

 

 

your new name...i do not approve...

 

 

 

I however, have used the word nigger casually in conversation, but MY issue is the term African-American, that shit is fucked up. MOST of the black people in the states today were born here, and therefore are AMERICAN... I dont call myself Irish american because my grandma is from Ireland.

[ChosenOne2000 4440]

Nigger is the only racial slur this clan seems to care about. We can rag on Jews, gays, Asians, Germans, trannies, literally anything else with no repercussions. The rule is stupid in that it is only enforced for nigger.

2. No and I wouldn't walk up to an 80lb white woman and call them a nigger either. But I would definitely use it casually in conversation to both parties, and have.

Also http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b48_1305790944

Then we should enforce the rule universally. Problem solved, right guys?

[BeauutifulChaos 902]

People should just not be so ignorant and know when they are crossing the line in general.

[BananaPeelz 709]

People should just not be so ignorant and know when they are crossing the line in general.

Except that line is completely subjective, hence the umbrella rule banning all uses of the word.

[BeauutifulChaos 902]

It's not subjective when you're not an idiot. ;D

 

I suppose I just don't understand why there is ever a need to say "HEY NIGGAHHHHHHHHHS" or "Yer such a spick lolololol" or anything of the sort. Even if you are just joking. Like, wat. 

Edited June 13, 2013 by BeauutifulChaos

[ElectronicDrug 7496]

Nigger is the only racial slur this clan seems to care about. We can rag on Jews, gays, Asians, Germans, trannies, literally anything else with no repercussions. The rule is stupid in that it is only enforced for nigger.

2. No and I wouldn't walk up to an 80lb white woman and call them a nigger either. But I would definitely use it casually in conversation to both parties, and have.

Also http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b48_1305790944

Then we should enforce the rule universally. Problem solved, right guys?

Yes.

[Mr British 210]

Living in a 98% white area I only know one black guy, and he nearly smashed a kids face in with a fire extinguisher when he called him a nigger

But then again the kid was an arsehole anyway so it might have not have had that much to do with it

[Detective Nom Noms 1033]

I could get into a story about my childhood and that word but it really wouldn't matter so ...

 

I laugh and keep going about my day.

Does that make me white?
 

Edited June 13, 2013 by Detective Nom Noms

[Oreo 2073]

I could get into a story about my childhood and that word but it really wouldn't matter so ...

 

I laugh and keep going about my day.

Does that make me white?

 

Yes.

Edited June 13, 2013 by Oreo

[Dyscivist 5686]

It's not subjective when you're not an idiot. ;D 

 

Except it is, you idiot.

[Jewinator 5000 750]

Except even you have acknowledged that removing the rule allows for offensive abuse of the word. The slippery slope "fallacy" is only a fallacy if he's drawing an unrelated conclusion from the premise, which he clearly isn't. Saying that allowing for the use of the n word in the servers will lead to teenagers yelling it a whole fucking lot for no reason is a pretty logically sound argument, as they do that even when it isn't permitted.

Honestly, this thread is pretty pointless, because there are only three options.

1) Staff changes the rule to allow the word's use: This is a bad idea for reasons we've discussed above.

2) Staff adds some sort of addendum that says the word is banned only when it's used offensively or maliciously: As you kindly pointed out, being offended by this or determining when it was used offensively is completely subjective. And as you've kindly pointed out, a lot of the admins of the servers are fucking morons. The last thing anyone wants is to give more leeway to interpretation of the rules and leave the decision making up to a 15 year-old with mommy's credit card. I'm just cringing at the thought of all the complaint threads birthed from that scenario.

3) You quit saying any variation of the "n-word": This is about the only reasonable choice. Grow the fuck up, remove it from your vocabulary, play your fucking video games, and when you accidentally let it slip learn to deal with the consequences.

I don't want either 1 or 2, and having these amended to the rules was never my intention. The point that I'm trying to make with this thread is that as it stands, the racism rules are enforced to a ridiculous degree. It's not even a racism rule, it's a "don't say this particular word ever" rule. Racism isn't stopped by this rule, lots of people say racist things all the time on the servers, they just don't accompany it with a racial slur. 

 

It's true that racism and racial slurs often go hand in hand, but this doesn't mean that when racism is occurring racial slurs are happening, and likewise it doesn't mean that when racial slurs are said racism is happening. Do you remember what I said about the alcohol rule in that really long post that you said you agreed with? If the racism rule was used in the same it would be great. That is the point that I'm making. 

 

Don't put words in my mouth and claim that I want to make racism or calling everyone a nigger legal. That isn't at all what I'm lobbying for. What I'm instead saying is that we have too strict of a policy on racism and that the admins ought to be a bit more lax in their enforcement, because as it is the admins are extremely overzealous in their enforcement.

 

Going back to what Oreo said, that if we were to be more lax on our enforcement of the racism rule we would have servers full of racists, this isn't true. This is indeed a slippery slope fallacy because it suggests that if we become slightly more lax this will certainly lead to all of the rules on racism being effectively worthless. The reasoning of this is that if the admins let people say "nigga please" "shiiit nigga" "damm nigga" it will inevitably lead to outright racism. The problem with this reasoning is that it assumes that there are plenty of racists already on our servers, all of them just waiting to be racist. That, or that we will attract a significant population of racists if we are to let the racism rule become slightly more lax.

 

However, to make this assumption we must first ask ourselves if we truly have a super-racist player base to begin with. And if we do have a super-racist player base already, that must mean that the racism rules are what's stopping them from shitting everything up with lots of racism. So, do we have a really racist player base to begin with? I don't think we do, cause if we did racism would be far more visible and present in all areas of sG. It's not like you have any actual data to prove that we do, so all that you can base this upon would be anecdotal evidence, which unless tons of people share your exact same story, is useless. Furthermore, if we did actually have a racist player base the racism rule wouldn't do anything to stop them. A racist person could rant as much as they want about black people being inherently inferior to white people or something, and as long as they don't ever say "nigger" in their speech things are fine. Furthermore, if we had a racist player base there would be far more support for 

 

So then, the only other way that the racism rule could lead to the player base being really racist would be if a more lax enforcement of the racism rule lead to the importation of a more racist population. This is also conjecture, which you can't actually prove. You may say "But it just makes sense that letting people say 'nigga' more will lead to more racism. If we give racists an inch, they'll take a mile and invite all their racist friends to come on our servers too. Pretty soon we'll be swimming in racism". But will it actually? If we let people say "nigga", will that directly translate to them being more racist or people coming to our server who are racist, and staying because they like being racist here?

 

This is why it's a slippery slope. You say that if we allow the rule to become slightly more lax then it would certainly lead to it becoming so lax that it wouldn't even be enforced at all. But there isn't any actual reason for the rule to become more lax, other than "muh slip and slide slope". It's like saying "if we send 100 troops into a foreign country, we'll end up sending thousands more" or "if we allow pornography to be censored, soon they'll be censoring movies and then burning books!" When event A occurs, it doesn't mean that events B C D all the way through Z have to follow. 

 

 

This semi annual topic makes me facepalm. If you are lobbying THIS hard to use racial slurs:

 

1. What does this say about you as a person?

2. You wouldn't walk up to a 250lbs black person and call them a nigger to their face in RL.

 

 

Stop trying to be an Internet tough guy. You just look like a dumbass... 

 

Is nigga even a racial slur anymore? If someone pointed to a group of people of various races and said "look at that nigga" I would have no idea who he was talking about. And as Drug said, I wouldn't walk up to anyone and call them a nigger, cause that's rude. But if I knew the black guy and was friends with him I would probably call him nigga, cause that's a socially acceptable thing to do, at least in my experience in HS. 

 

There's a notable difference between "nigga" and "nigger", with the latter being offensive the latter not. And as Drug pointed out, since black people seem to be the only group that we try to stop racism against, shouldn't we be trying to protect all sorts of groups of people from harassment? The rules wouldn't seem so hypocritical if we did that. 

Edited June 13, 2013 by Jewinator 5000

[Name 2616]

I don't think I've ever seen Jewinator more serious over anything than the word nigger

[Jewinator 5000 750]

I thought Jewinator joined SiJ in hopes of a promotion lol  Why is our forum still plagued by his presence?

 

Also, I read you kick yourself after saying racial slurs to avoid being banned? seems like a way to avoid punishment can a staff member get on this?

 

fuk u fag 

Edited June 13, 2013 by Jewinator 5000

[Goldentongue 3616]

All I got from that tryhard wall of text is that there wouldn't be an issue if you would just stop saying "nigger".

[Jewinator 5000 750]

Nigger is far more offensive than nigga. Nigger implies that I'm calling someone a subhuman piece of shit, while nigga is just common vernacular.

 

Why should I stop saying nigga? Cause it may offend someone at some point? So many people are offended by so many things, I don't want to watch my vocabulary for everything. 

 

"FUCK YOU SHITLORD DON'T YOU KNOW THAT THAT WORD OFFENDS PEOPLE!?!?!?!?!" isn't a valid argument for why I shouldn't use certain words. 

Edited June 13, 2013 by Jewinator 5000

[Detective Nom Noms 1033]

Personally, I hate it when people use the excuse that "nigga" isn't the same as "nigger".

To me it is extremely stupid. I hate it when I hear other black people call me their "nigga".

Then again, I make sure not to know people like that. Easy.

[Elmo 1272]

Personally, I hate it when people use the excuse that "nigga" isn't the same as "nigger".

To me it is extremely stupid. I hate it when I hear other black people call me their "nigga".

Then again, I make sure not to know people like that. Easy.

They must be blind. 

[Detective Nom Noms 1033]

Because I don't play up the typical black person role and I am still told, "What's up my nigga"?

Eh... If that's the case I would rather be called white than to be stereotypical to every other fucking black person in America.

Edited June 13, 2013 by Detective Nom Noms

[Jewinator 5000 750]

Personally, I hate it when people use the excuse that "nigga" isn't the same as "nigger".

To me it is extremely stupid. I hate it when I hear other black people call me their "nigga".

Then again, I make sure not to know people like that. Easy.

sorry if I ever offend you bruh, but I probably offend lots of people without even thinking about it, and I don't want to watch everything that I say cause I may be offensive to some 

[Detective Nom Noms 1033]

sorry if I ever offend you bruh, but I probably offend lots of people without even thinking about it, and I don't want to watch everything that I say cause I may be offensive to some 

I don't get offened. It's the fucking internet. You don't get offened with that shit.

[MikeHeadJanitor 73]

Now everyone is using the word "niger" just to make it seem not racist.

[Spell 331]

For sG as a community to allow the usage of any racial slurs, whether they be in common vernacular or not would be in contrast to normal social convention. Why should we allow people to be arbitrarily racist or use racist terms which could then be interpreted as racism. This interpretation stems from the fact that in the normal social medium, being arbitrarily racist is looked down upon and discouraged. Why would we, as a community, wish to promote the indifference towards this when we host a wide variety of ethnic backgrounds, including black, white, Hispanic, middle eastern, Asian.

 

The idea is to make the community environment more acceptable to a wider range of people. If we allowed terms such as nigger, cracker, spic, beaner, Camel Jockey, Chink,Gook or any other racial term, logic dictates that most people would find this to be fairly offensive and off putting. Same concept can be applied to any religious demonetization such as Islamic, Jewish, Christian, Catholic, Taoist, Buddhist, ect. It makes more sense to not allow any racial or other epithets that would cause major discomfort either on the server or on people looking to join. 

 

 

I agree with Golden here, the best way is to just eliminate these words from your spoken vocabulary. Other than extremely informal occasions, there really is no need to even use any of the words.

[HoeStomper 200]

As many of you know I am black, Like stay away from my daughter charcoal black. ChosenOne knows how I feel he can relate.

 

To be honest this is not offensive at all you just make it seem that way. Just like talking to other people about your dead mom in the cellar.

[Jewinator 5000 750]

For sG as a community to allow the usage of any racial slurs, whether they be in common vernacular or not would be in contrast to normal social convention. Why should we allow people to be arbitrarily racist or use racist terms which could then be interpreted as racism. This interpretation stems from the fact that in the normal social medium, being arbitrarily racist is looked down upon and discouraged. Why would we, as a community, wish to promote the indifference towards this when we host a wide variety of ethnic backgrounds, including black, white, Hispanic, middle eastern, Asian.

 

The idea is to make the community environment more acceptable to a wider range of people. If we allowed terms such as nigger, cracker, spic, beaner, Camel Jockey, Chink,Gook or any other racial term, logic dictates that most people would find this to be fairly offensive and off putting. Same concept can be applied to any religious demonetization such as Islamic, Jewish, Christian, Catholic, Taoist, Buddhist, ect. It makes more sense to not allow any racial or other epithets that would cause major discomfort either on the server or on people looking to join. 

 

 

I agree with Golden here, the best way is to just eliminate these words from your spoken vocabulary. Other than extremely informal occasions, there really is no need to even use any of the words.

So can I have protection for having red hair? Cause this community has been downright unwelcoming to people with red hair. 

 

Also, you say that you're doing everything you do in the name of making sure remains open to as many people as possible, of as many different backgrounds as we can. Yet, the only part of the racism rules that are enforced are the usage of racial slurs. That's like, all of it.You make us sound like eGO, trying to be as open and accepting to as many people as possible. What if harsh language offends me as a Christian? What if being called a faggot offends me as a homosexual? What if being called an aspie offends me as a person with Autism? 

 

I don't understand why you would want to make a community that's as open as possible to as many people as possible. 

[Oreo 2073]

Alright, i'm going to start this off by pointing out a major irony in your wall of text.

 

 

Don't put words in my mouth and claim that I want to make racism or calling everyone a nigger legal. That isn't at all what I'm lobbying for. What I'm instead saying is that we have too strict of a policy on racism and that the admins ought to be a bit more lax in their enforcement, because as it is the admins are extremely overzealous in their enforcement.

 

Going back to what Oreo said, that if we were to be more lax on our enforcement of the racism rule we would have servers full of racists, this isn't true. This is indeed a slippery slope fallacy because it suggests that if we become slightly more lax this will certainly lead to all of the rules on racism being effectively worthless. The reasoning of this is that if the admins let people say "nigga please" "shiiit nigga" "damm nigga" it will inevitably lead to outright racism. The problem with this reasoning is that it assumes that there are plenty of racists already on our servers, all of them just waiting to be racist. That, or that we will attract a significant population of racists if we are to let the racism rule become slightly more lax.

 

 

First of all, you're complaining he's putting words in your mouth when he's stating exactly what you're suggesting; which is that we have a more relaxed attitude towards racism and allow the usage of the word nigger, spick, etc in our servers. The fact is, we are relaxed with it, it's very rare you see someone actually banned for racism. Second of all, you're putting words in my mouth and you don't understand what a fallacy is. You're actually pulling a Straw Man here, suggesting a misrepresentation of what i'm saying and attempting to refute my argument. I never once stated the following;

 

 

 

Going back to what Oreo said, that if we were to be more lax on our enforcement of the racism rule we would have servers full of racists, this isn't true. This is indeed a slippery slope fallacy because it suggests that if we become slightly more lax this will certainly lead to all of the rules on racism being effectively worthless. The reasoning of this is that if the admins let people say "nigga please" "shiiit nigga" "damm nigga" it will inevitably lead to outright racism. The problem with this reasoning is that it assumes that there are plenty of racists already on our servers, all of them just waiting to be racist. That, or that we will attract a significant population of racists if we are to let the racism rule become slightly more lax.

 

 

Please point out when I did say this. I never once said that we would have servers full of racists nor that there are racists in hiding or waiting to hop on our servers if the rules become more relaxed towards racism. I said the following;

 

 

 

It's enforced strongly because if there were exceptions then we would see a slippery slope situation, which is what we have seen in the past few months. It progressed from joking comments to blatant racism.

 

What I said is true and I can cite multiple examples in the past few months under Mitch and a few of his staff butt buddies that you're well acquainted with at SIJ(Dohohoho, see what I did thar). Now, here's where your slippery slope fallacy argument fails;

 

"The heart of the slippery slope fallacy lies in abusing the intuitively appreciable transitivity of implication, claiming that A leads to B, B leads to C, C leads to D and so on, until one finally claims that A leads to Z. While this is formally valid when the premises are taken as a given, each of those contingencies needs to be factually established before the relevant conclusion can be drawn. Slippery slope fallacies occur when this is not done—an argument that supports the relevant premises is not fallacious and thus isn't a slippery slope fallacy."

 

A slippery slope argument is not always a fallacy contrary to what your Google research tells you. For it to be a fallacy, what I am suggesting would have to be non sequitar and I would have to use extreme examples to win my argument by leveraging fear. I'm not doing that. The fact of the matter is, what I am suggesting is factually proven by the very posts of this forum and is evident in the past few months under the recently resigned staff. You know this so I don't understand why you're arguing against it. An example of a slippery slope fallacy would be saying;

 

"Well if we let them pierce their ears, soon they'll pierce their belly button, get tattoos and start dressing in a very slutty manner!"

 

I'm simply saying that in the past few months, relaxing our view on racism has led to multiple bouts of blatant racism such as Sandy's thread aimed at Chosenone during the Christmas break. This didn't result in every single event being blatantly racist, many of the posts were kept in a humorous manner not aimed to cause harm but here and there we did have these events occur due to people feeling less wary of the consequences and more comfortable of doing it when under the relaxed rules.

 

 

However, to make this assumption we must first ask ourselves if we truly have a super-racist player base to begin with. And if we do have a super-racist player base already, that must mean that the racism rules are what's stopping them from shitting everything up with lots of racism. So, do we have a really racist player base to begin with? I don't think we do, cause if we did racism would be far more visible and present in all areas of sG. It's not like you have any actual data to prove that we do, so all that you can base this upon would be anecdotal evidence, which unless tons of people share your exact same story, is useless. Furthermore, if we did actually have a racist player base the racism rule wouldn't do anything to stop them. A racist person could rant as much as they want about black people being inherently inferior to white people or something, and as long as they don't ever say "nigger" in their speech things are fine. Furthermore, if we had a racist player base there would be far more support for 

 

So then, the only other way that the racism rule could lead to the player base being really racist would be if a more lax enforcement of the racism rule lead to the importation of a more racist population. This is also conjecture, which you can't actually prove. You may say "But it just makes sense that letting people say 'nigga' more will lead to more racism. If we give racists an inch, they'll take a mile and invite all their racist friends to come on our servers too. Pretty soon we'll be swimming in racism". But will it actually? If we let people say "nigga", will that directly translate to them being more racist or people coming to our server who are racist, and staying because they like being racist here?

 

This is why it's a slippery slope. You say that if we allow the rule to become slightly more lax then it would certainly lead to it becoming so lax that it wouldn't even be enforced at all. But there isn't any actual reason for the rule to become more lax, other than "muh slip and slide slope". It's like saying "if we send 100 troops into a foreign country, we'll end up sending thousands more" or "if we allow pornography to be censored, soon they'll be censoring movies and then burning books!" When event A occurs, it doesn't mean that events B C D all the way through Z have to follow. 

 

 

Once again, you're basing this off the strawman, i'm not even going to try to respond to this.

 

 

Is nigga even a racial slur anymore? If someone pointed to a group of people of various races and said "look at that nigga" I would have no idea who he was talking about. And as Drug said, I wouldn't walk up to anyone and call them a nigger, cause that's rude. But if I knew the black guy and was friends with him I would probably call him nigga, cause that's a socially acceptable thing to do, at least in my experience in High School.

 

It's not a socially acceptable thing to do for many people, your freshman class of high school isn't a good example of what is socially acceptable and what isn't.

 

 

There's a notable difference between "nigga" and "nigger", with the latter being offensive the latter not. And as Drug pointed out, since black people seem to be the only group that we try to stop racism against, shouldn't we be trying to protect all sorts of groups of people from harassment? The rules wouldn't seem so hypocritical if we did that.

 

No, there is not a difference between the two. It's the same word just used in a different situation and many people take offense to both of them. Black people aren't the only group that we try to stop racism against either, it's just the ethnic group that tends to receive most of the racist comments. We are as protective of that ethnicity as we are of spanish, Jewish and any other ethnicity. I've kicked people for ranting about Jews and the community was very against Slavic Falanges ideals towards them. The rules have never seemed hypocritical to me disregarding when we allow it to happen and do nothing about it, which is something we do not condone but which does happen sometimes. There is an answer to that but it's not by removing a rule therefore allowing it to be suddenly acceptable in our community.

 

 

Note: I'm writing this in a bit of a hurry so I might have errors here and there.

Edited June 14, 2013 by Oreo