Admin Punishment Scale

[Oracion 35]

Considering what I and others have seen in the CD lately, it's seeming like some admins are getting called out for doing things, but yet lately it's a "I'll talk with him" or "I'll warn him, and it'll be good" thing. Not saying you shouldn't talk with them, or that the Adv/Managers aren't being hardcore or being bad at their jobs, but I'd say having a set punishment like we do with infractions would be good for people to see and understand what will happen if legit complaints against them are found to be true and need to be punished.

I was thinking of just one set way, with tallying strikes against an admin, no ifs ands, or buts with it. Something like this.

First strike - warning

Second strike - admin revoked for two days.

Third strike - Admin revoked for a week.

Fourth - loss of admin completely.

Obviously the values can be altered to how staff sees fit, but I think this would get the point across of letting people know that admin is to be used correctly, not as they see it fit for them, or if they misunderstand rules constantly and how to punish things.

Only issue I see with this is that it would be up to Adv/Managers to decide if an offense is strike worthy or worth the time, but this might be a start in a direction to keep things a bit more crisp with who's buying power, or received power over the time in the clan.

[Mitch 2111]

I would think a Remedial Admin School punishment might also be a good option.

[Oracion 35]

I would think a Remedial Admin School punishment might also be a good option.

For a sort of 'rehab' for the admin? Yeah, I'm down for that. Might give me something to do as well if me and Noire work this Admin School thing out.

[Longcat 126]

Not only is there issue with the gray area between strike-worthy or not, there is also the general lack of evidence that usually comes with admin abuse threads. How do you expect us to rule in a thread where its entirely he said/he said? We go on a basis of innocent until proven guilty in every single complaint thread. An admin may get 10 complaint threads, but unless there are four of those that are actually well evidenced, it would be against policy to ban them. It may seem like bureaucracy, but its protection from frivolous complaints and lies.

I dont think a remedial admin school would help. Admin school is still a good idea and a good way to ensure prior knowledge of rules, but if we can ensure that they have seen the rules and they still break rules and admin abuse at inappropriate times, thats just dickery and they would learn nothing from a rehab.

[Kaleidoscopic 0]

I'd have to agree with Longcat. You can't punish someone for something like this unless there is solid evidence.

[Guest Waffle]

I thought it was three strikes and you're out, Oracion.

[Owns 0]

Considering what I and others have seen in the CD lately, it's seeming like some admins are getting called out for doing things, but yet lately it's a "I'll talk with him" or "I'll warn him, and it'll be good" thing. Not saying you shouldn't talk with them, or that the Adv/Managers aren't being hardcore or being bad at their jobs, but I'd say having a set punishment like we do with infractions would be good for people to see and understand what will happen if legit complaints against them are found to be true and need to be punished.

I was thinking of just one set way, with tallying strikes against an admin, no ifs ands, or buts with it. Something like this.

First strike - warning

Second strike - admin revoked for two days.

Third strike - Admin revoked for a week.

Fourth - loss of admin completely.

Obviously the values can be altered to how staff sees fit, but I think this would get the point across of letting people know that admin is to be used correctly, not as they see it fit for them, or if they misunderstand rules constantly and how to punish things.

Only issue I see with this is that it would be up to Adv/Managers to decide if an offense is strike worthy or worth the time, but this might be a start in a direction to keep things a bit more crisp with who's buying power, or received power over the time in the clan.

Not only is there issue with the gray area between strike-worthy or not, there is also the general lack of evidence that usually comes with admin abuse threads. How do you expect us to rule in a thread where its entirely he said/he said? We go on a basis of innocent until proven guilty in every single complaint thread. An admin may get 10 complaint threads, but unless there are four of those that are actually well evidenced, it would be against policy to ban them. It may seem like bureaucracy, but its protection from frivolous complaints and lies.

I dont think a remedial admin school would help. Admin school is still a good idea and a good way to ensure prior knowledge of rules, but if we can ensure that they have seen the rules and they still break rules and admin abuse at inappropriate times, thats just dickery and they would learn nothing from a rehab.

I'd have to agree with Longcat. You can't punish someone for something like this unless there is solid evidence.

You fucking people need to learn to read the entire post before commenting on something... longcat just stated the obvious... fucking duh.

Oracion said that this should be a scale for LEGIT COMPLAINTS... I say first time they do it warn them, second time revoke their admin and keep their subscription, if they wanna pay for it again then fine but if another LEGIT COMPLAINT happens then revoke their ability to have admin permanently. 4 Chances seems a bit too much, plus it would cut down on the retardedness.

[Oracion 35]

You fucking people need to learn to read the entire post before commenting on something... longcat just stated the obvious... fucking duh.

Oracion said that this should be a scale for LEGIT COMPLAINTS... I say first time they do it warn them, second time revoke their admin and keep their subscription, if they wanna pay for it again then fine but if another LEGIT COMPLAINT happens then revoke their ability to have admin permanently. 4 Chances seems a bit too much, plus it would cut down on the retardedness.

This.

And yeah, like I said, it doesn't have to follow said scale directly that I posted, but it's just an idea. Obviously it's not going to go against people who SOLELY get complained against but no true verdict happens to them. No sense in giving a strike if there's no proof. I'm solely talking about people who are abusing and it HAS BEEN PROVEN so.

[Noire 17]

I say make the admin school thread. Give people in charge of admin school access to the admin accounts. Have people who have legitimate complaints against them go to admin school. Have their admin suspended till they complete their lesson.

Oh wait, we had this idea a long time ago...

[Zachmanman 877]

I'd have to agree with Longcat. You can't punish someone for something like this unless there is solid evidence.

quit spamming douche

I suggested a long time ago that we remove the command they abused as punishment. Take cl4p as our most recent example. He abused his noclip, health command, freeze, and burn. We should take those away for a month as punishment. Then if he keeps screwing up with others we remove them. If admin abuse is more serious of course, like someone just blatantly trying to fuck up our servers then admin removal would be a good choice. Im just thinking this would be good to use on people who slap too much in jailbreak etc.

[Desolator 0]

quit spamming douche

I suggested a long time ago that we remove the command they abused as punishment. Take cl4p as our most recent example. He abused his noclip, health command, freeze, and burn. We should take those away for a month as punishment. Then if he keeps screwing up with others we remove them. If admin abuse is more serious of course, like someone just blatantly trying to fuck up our servers then admin removal would be a good choice. Im just thinking this would be good to use on people who slap too much in jailbreak etc.

I agree with this to an extent, but just taking away the few commands they abuse doesn't really mean much when they may have taken away from server populations for any command they abused. I'm not saying that any abuse should be an automatic removal, but if you abuse more than one or two rules..... that could possibly be taking away from all of the server populations. If you abuse 4 rules as you stated, perhaps you shouldn't have admin at all. Maybe if you abuse 2 or 3 rules, the admin should just be gone. The community doesn't want to drive away possible members just because some dumbass feels the need to flex their epeen. I understand what you're saying with the obvious abuses of kicks and bans and what not, that it is unacceptable, but abusing that many of the lesser powers is kind of ridiculous. Its nothing more than flexing your power and taking away from the population servers could achieve.

Obviously the accused admins should be able to defend themselves, but the goal is to have a community that thrives on old members and the induction of new clan and community members, which even a couple of rounds of abuse could detour.

edit\\ No we don't want to seem like hardasses that can't have a good time either, but is one person paying a few dollars a month really worth losing the other 15 people who could contribute monetarily or constructively? At least thats my opinion on the matter -shrugs-

[Oracion 35]

edit\\ No we don't want to seem like hardasses that can't have a good time either, but is one person paying a few dollars a month really worth losing the other 15 people who could contribute monetarily or constructively? At least thats my opinion on the matter -shrugs-

Agreed on this. I'd rather get rid of the bad apple, instead of keeping him for the profit. No sense in having someone with power who's pissing off people in game.

[Elmo 1272]

quit spamming douche

I suggested a long time ago that we remove the command they abused as punishment. Take cl4p as our most recent example. He abused his noclip, health command, freeze, and burn. We should take those away for a month as punishment. Then if he keeps screwing up with others we remove them. If admin abuse is more serious of course, like someone just blatantly trying to fuck up our servers then admin removal would be a good choice. Im just thinking this would be good to use on people who slap too much in jailbreak etc.

yeah i know cl4p abuse admin twice already but i think he got only like 1 day ban. i think clap admin should be removed