Poll: Armor on JB?

[Hawk 1124]

Been seeing some discussion about this so let's just make it a poll.

At first I thought that 40 armor was good but I forgot that the damage will be the same regardless of the amount of armor so might as well do either 0 or 100, that is why there are no options like 30, 40 or 50 armor.

 

In my opinion we should have 0 armor and a helmet cause that way CTs can get knifed but wont be as vulnerable to the one taps from glocks, p250s and USPs.

 

Will also work on removing armor during LR so don't worry about that part.

[Dakka 854]

Armor is a crutch for bad CT's.

A GOOD CT Team:

1. Positions themselves well
2. Pays attention to possible rebels amongst the T's
3. Watches each other's backs
4. Knows that weapons are what the T's are after and keeps them out of reach at all times
5. Focuses on the objective (kill off T's, give LR, win)

You don't need armor to win.

 

 

[Bluestreakid15 540]

I do think that especially with the CT:T ratios that we usually have now, the CTs could use a bit of a handicap. 

[Dylan 558]

47 minutes ago, Dakka said:

Armor is a crutch for bad CT's.

A GOOD CT Team:

1. Positions themselves well
2. Pays attention to possible rebels amongst the T's
3. Watches each other's backs
4. Knows that weapons are what the T's are after and keeps them out of reach at all times
5. Focuses on the objective (kill off T's, give LR, win)

You don't need armor to win.

 

 

It’s not Comp it’s Jailbreak I don’t want to Try hard everyround to play jailbreak it’s tiring and annoying and isn’t what jailbreak is about, if you’d like a more competitive game mode try war3 :^)

[Sean 3760]

1 minute ago, vexer said:

It’s not Comp it’s Jailbreak I don’t want to Try hard everyround to play jailbreak it’s tiring and annoying and isn’t what jailbreak is about, if you’d like a more competitive game mode try war3 :^)

Do you always parrot what other people say or can you come up with your own conclusions?

[Dylan 558]

1 hour ago, Sean said:

Do you always parrot what other people say or can you come up with your own conclusions?

Maybe people just have similar opinions.

 

[Nau 739]

I originally voted for armor w/ no helmet but I think 0 armor with a helmet is best. Still rewards aim with most pistols being able to 2 tap. 

[Revöker 656]

So now take this with a grain of salt but I looked into the bias of this vote.  Using GameMe I look at the percentage of players on different teams (NOTE: GameMe isn't perfect because they use how often you select the team you want to play and not how long you played on that team). I could try to calculate the total time spent on each team, but even that isn't perfect because it still doesn't total to the amount of time people have on the server (Although I guess those are AFK spectator hours).  So once again take this with a grain of salt .

 

 

The further red the percentage is the more that player plays on T.  The further blue a player is the more they play CT (with about +/-10% error)

 

What I do find interesting here is that

• Imperium has apparently never played CT so clearly he doesn't have a vote in balance. 
• Props to Sweetrock and Mistachang for almost always playing CT.  
• 7 of 9 (78%) players that voted 0 armor/helmet were somewhat CT biased
• 5 of 11 (45%) players that voted 0 armor were somewhat T biased

Finally, I wouldn't mind 0 armor + helmet because as I said I hate the one headshot pistols, having to shot 20 more times at the chest with armor is a bit unnecessary.  The only problem is coding this, I know for one mappers would always have a hard time doing this without vscript; but idk how @KiD Fearless would stand up to it.

[Booch 257]

This isn't meant to be mean but half the time I play ct and I warden and I'm moving ts or looking for a game the other half of my team doesn't  watch for rebellers and I just get one tapped with a GLOCK and I have an AK and he can wins because he can fire in a stack? I get the frustration as well because you have to take forever to knife a ct all the way down so in that regard I can see the frustration. I think now that pop hasn't gotten more regular than it used to be. I guess newer cts are going to have to learn how to get one shot and smack your keyboard out of frustration. 

[Shadow 1044]

29 minutes ago, Booch said:

This isn't meant to be mean but half the time I play ct and I warden and I'm moving ts or looking for a game the other half of my team doesn't  watch for rebellers and I just get one tapped with a GLOCK and I have an AK and he can wins because he can fire in a stack? I get the frustration as well because you have to take forever to knife a ct all the way down so in that regard I can see the frustration. I think now that pop hasn't gotten more regular than it used to be. I guess newer cts are going to have to learn how to get one shot and smack your keyboard out of frustration. 

You definitely didn’t get one tapped with a glock on JB unless you took damage already unless you are taking about prearmor JB. It previously was always one taps and better rebellers were able to derail a round with a pistol unless better CTs and wardens were around once the killing started. That might be too much to expect now, so as long as you can 2 tap that’s not bad. But having to hit 4 HS in a row against one CT is too much. I am still bias toward no helmet no armor because that is how most of us played Ct and it was still easy, but we could experiment with helmet no armor and see how it feels.

[Nau 739]

14 hours ago, Revöker said:

So now take this with a grain of salt but I looked into the bias of this vote.  Using GameMe I look at the percentage of players on different teams (NOTE: GameMe isn't perfect because they use how often you select the team you want to play and not how long you played on that team). I could try to calculate the total time spent on each team, but even that isn't perfect because it still doesn't total to the amount of time people have on the server (Although I guess those are AFK spectator hours).  So once again take this with a grain of salt .

 

 

The further red the percentage is the more that player plays on T.  The further blue a player is the more they play CT (with about +/-10% error)

 

What I do find interesting here is that

• Imperium has apparently never played CT so clearly he doesn't have a vote in balance. 
• Props to Sweetrock and Mistachang for almost always playing CT.  
• 7 of 9 (78%) players that voted 0 armor/helmet were somewhat CT biased
• 5 of 11 (45%) players that voted 0 armor were somewhat T biased

Finally, I wouldn't mind 0 armor + helmet because as I said I hate the one headshot pistols, having to shot 20 more times at the chest with armor is a bit unnecessary.  The only problem is coding this, I know for one mappers would always have a hard time doing this without vscript; but idk how @KiD Fearless would stand up to it.

Can I get a shoutout for being a hard neutral

[Dakka 854]

1 hour ago, Nau said:

Can I get a shoutout for being a hard neutral

Feelsbalancedman

[trav 6834]

Armor and Helmet every time.

 

You're a terrorist and have been put in jail. If you want to be free, you'll have to fight for it and be as crafty as you can.

 

All the best maps give CTs armor and helm anyways. It makes for a better JB experience.

 

Imo rebelling shouldn't be easy. If you want to fuck up a round and fuck over the CTs, earn it by being good and timing your approach well.

[Dakota 4722]

Are yall that bad that you need the guards to have no armor? What kind of jail has defenseless guards. 

[Mark from Facebook 1285]

I thought that the idea of no armor would be to the solution of the problem, hence why I voted that way. Specially so when T's want to rebel, it would make more sense for it to happen. 

 

Playing the past 2 days in JB for a couple of hours, in high pop, moderate pop and low pop, it came to the realization of how much damage we can do as a prisoner with no armor to the CT team.

 

I want to change my vote to Armor but no helmet (certain maps give you pistols to rebel, and it would destroy those maps if there were helmets). 

Or maybe find a 50/50 (50 armor + Helmet being in use), but then I think that would be useless.

 

Its hard to find a balance, be cause if it is 100 armor and helmet, I feel like it is very CT sided (I do understand that there is a disparity between CT and T's , so there will never be " CT sided" ), but with no armor it becomes too easy to rebel.

 

 

100 armor no helmet

 seems to be the most viable way to do so, because 0 armor + helmet would equate to just as easy of a rebel (2 cut), 100 armor would put them to a more valid standpoint against your average knife fight, but vunerable to maps with pistols to start.

 

IF THE MAP GIVES YOU ARMOR+HELMET THAT IS FINE, BUT NOT EVERY MAP DOES SO. SO ON AVERAGE, I FEEL LIKE IT WOULD BE A BIT MORE BALANCED

 

[Nau 739]

24 minutes ago, Beerman said:

Are yall that bad that you need the guards to have no armor? What kind of jail has defenseless guards. 

Most prison guards don't carry weapons in the U.S. At least the ones that interact closely with the prisoners.

[Carl Sagan 2577]

I don't play JB anymore but I'll put in my two cents:

 

CT's are supposed to be disposable. They have all the control for the round. Dont like them stacking and killing you while you try and set up simon says? Dont stack them, and do gun checks. Its not supposed to be an easy game for CT's, we have had 10 years of proper orders to refer back to. Not the terrorists fault you guys see this as a social experiment instead of a round of Counter Strike. The game has worked fine in this state. The reasons for changing it seem arbitrary and, to be honest, selfish from the perspective of clan members who know the rules and post on the forums. Good job extracting data from a sample size of 20 people, that's totally scientific.

 

 

Glock headshots absolutely need to remain in jailbreak, I cant believe this is even being discussed. Bad CT's start with weapons cant even 1v1 terrorists with a knife.

 

 

And before some newfag staff call me out for being inactive or something:   This is the server I joined, and you actually ruined it.

 

[Shadow 1044]

@Travesty The server shouldn't become like eGo and the other JB servers where rebelling is extremely difficult or you have to time it perfectly. It has never been like that here. If I have a glock and you have a helmet and armor I am going to have to hit you three times with 2 being in the face at the minimum unless you are standing right next to me, which doesn't happen often. After hitting those shots if I step out of the stack I will be dead by  the 5 AWPs trained on the stack.  CSGO is not CSS. Killing CTs in a stack is much harder in CSGO because teammates absorb the bullets instead of going through like in CSS. If that was still the case I could see the argument, but most of the time shooting in a stack unless you have a armor pen pistol, isn't going to down more than 1 or 2 CTs(if you can aim, which most Ts cannot) and you are going to die by strafing out of the stack. In this new gen of JB most the JB maps that are popular (map games only, huge maps) are very difficult to rebel on anyway due to the distance you have to travel and lack of armory access, elaborate secrets and no random pistols in cells. It is very easy to play CT now compared to before, so no I do not think that 100% of the time that CTs should have full armor and helmet. On the maps that give armor that is fine because a few CTs do not grab it and it is only about half the maps. This is all my opinion, but when I do play CT it is extremely easy because I can tank shots and just wait for a rebellers to stutter step or strafe outside the stack and dome them.

[trav 6834]

You guys are thinking of when JB is full with 30+ and there's a multitude of CTs like it used to be. But it just simply isn't that way anymore...

 

Usually there are only 2 or 3 CTs. And when the pop is high, you can expect about 5 or 6 on the team. Killing off 2 CTs already derails a round and then it goes to shit. And if that continues then people just leave. Just because it's the way sG has always done it doesn't mean that's the route we should take. See: detours and delays, !lr, etc.

 

Rebellers can try to shoot from the stack but it won't likely do much with a pistol in hand. Now it's up to the rebeller to be more timely when they shoot at CTs, either by picking off a weak one (one who's far away from the team) and trying to obtain their primary weapon and then running away.

 

 

Tbh I think it's fine the way it is and we shouldn't change anything just because we had a few couple nights with 25 people on lol. If we can get steady pop for a month straight or longer, then I can see maybe switching it to 0 armor. Right now that's just not the gamemode though.

 

 

 

[Sean 3760]

Simple solution: Create plugin that detects number of CTs on round start and provide armor depending on that number.

[Nau 739]

26 minutes ago, Travesty said:

You guys are thinking of when JB is full with 30+ and there's a multitude of CTs like it used to be. But it just simply isn't that way anymore...

 

Usually there are only 2 or 3 CTs. And when the pop is high, you can expect about 5 or 6 on the team. Killing off 2 CTs already derails a round and then it goes to shit. And if that continues then people just leave. Just because it's the way sG has always done it doesn't mean that's the route we should take. See: detours and delays, !lr, etc.

 

Rebellers can try to shoot from the stack but it won't likely do much with a pistol in hand. Now it's up to the rebeller to be more timely when they shoot at CTs, either by picking off a weak one (one who's far away from the team) and trying to obtain their primary weapon and then running away.

 

 

Tbh I think it's fine the way it is and we shouldn't change anything just because we had a few couple nights with 25 people on lol. If we can get steady pop for a month straight or longer, then I can see maybe switching it to 0 armor. Right now that's just not the gamemode though.

 

 

 

That argument goes both ways 3 cts 7 t's if there is a single shred of competence on CT its near impossible on most of the new maps

[Dakota 4722]

1 hour ago, Nau said:

Most prison guards don't carry weapons in the U.S. At least the ones that interact closely with the prisoners.

You're right. At spawn console should be ran to strip cts and ts. No knives. No guns. Just pure orders and games. I'm about it 

[Nau 739]

Just now, Beerman said:

You're right. At spawn console should be ran to strip cts and ts. No knives. No guns. Just pure orders and games. I'm about it 

"What kind of jail has defenseless guards?" You asked. The real kind

[Dakota 4722]

17 minutes ago, Nau said:

"What kind of jail has defenseless guards?" You asked. The real kind

You are taking this far too seriously jesus fuck. 

[Shadow 1044]

31 minutes ago, Travesty said:

You guys are thinking of when JB is full with 30+ and there's a multitude of CTs like it used to be. But it just simply isn't that way anymore...

 

Usually there are only 2 or 3 CTs. And when the pop is high, you can expect about 5 or 6 on the team. Killing off 2 CTs already derails a round and then it goes to shit. And if that continues then people just leave. Just because it's the way sG has always done it doesn't mean that's the route we should take. See: detours and delays, !lr, etc.

 

Rebellers can try to shoot from the stack but it won't likely do much with a pistol in hand. Now it's up to the rebeller to be more timely when they shoot at CTs, either by picking off a weak one (one who's far away from the team) and trying to obtain their primary weapon and then running away.

 

 

Tbh I think it's fine the way it is and we shouldn't change anything just because we had a few couple nights with 25 people on lol. If we can get steady pop for a month straight or longer, then I can see maybe switching it to 0 armor. Right now that's just not the gamemode though.

 

 

 

I typically play when the pop is around 10. So I wasn't providing examples for only large pop, but small pop as well as that is what I am use to when I have been playing for the last few weeks. With small amount of people it is just as hard to rebel because you cannot blend in and if you are missing it is obvious. As far as the "that is the way sG has always been" argument, I agree that we need to adapt, but I disagree that we become cookie cutter with other successful servers that have an established population. Why would anyone choose our cookie cutter server over theirs when they have over 40 pop on at all times? Now you are describing how it is to rebel on the already popular servers by waiting forever until you can pick off a CT and grab a rifle. We might as well add the color rebeller plugin too. 

 

No detours and delays I agree with since we lost so many of the regular wardens to help new wardens/CTs.

 

The LR plugin is only because we don't have as many active admins, so that when admins are lacking there is a way to honor LR. 

 

I could just as easily go CT and warden like Beerman and kill the server or just sit on CT like Will while Nau wardens and murder everyone who flinches and make anyone who not a kid who wants to follow orders leave. I always liked that our server was more T sided and allowed for more then just sit and do what the warden says and play a bunch of MGs, which is what most people who play JB want. It also makes CT more interesting. The reason I don't play CT is because it is boring being so easy now a days. 

 

The issue is when there are no component CTs it doesn't matter if you rebel or not the rounds either a) take too long, which kills pop or b) rebellers derail them and the CTs leave and then everyone follows.  Rebelling isn't what kills the server, it is incompetent CTs and lack of admins IMO.

 

By your argument about not having a steady pop obviously the 100 armor and helmet didn't help since the server has stayed dead majority of the time that plugin was added, so the change should be irrelevant.