Night Elf Entangling Roots change

[Serif The Sheriff 73]

I was told as soon as I started playing again that there had been some changes to NE, mostly nerfs, which is no big deal, still my favorite race and if it helps balancing then that's great. However the one thing I am curious about is the change to NE's entangle to make it a LOS instead of AOE. From what I understood talking to people on the server, the change happened mostly because it was cheap for a NE to spam the ult and hit people through walls and basically have wall hacks. Since I wasn't around when this change was happening I am not sure what other ideas people had to try and balance that or if there were other ideas, but did anyone suggest removing the lines that are drawn to the entangled player?

 

This would make it so if you heard someone walking towards you but they are around a corner, or if you hear them on the other side of a door or wall you can still entangle them and use that to your advantage without being shown exactly where they are. For example, on Italy in tunnel, if I am on T and a CT is running up the tunnel I could hide around the corner and once I hear him getting closer I can entangle him then turn the corner and fight, since there is no line I don't know exactly where he is and still have to make a guess based on what I could hear just like anyone without entangle would have to, the only difference is that I can freeze him in place and prevent him from getting into cover or coming around the corner when I don't want him to. With the LOS you can't do that, and from what I was told you also can't entangle people behind you which means if you are trying to run away and someone is chasing you you would have to turn around to entangle them instead of just running away.

 

Any thoughts?

[xmen 983]

That was the problem in the first place you could camp a corner and freeze peek people without them being able to do anything...

 

Edit: and so it begins... :|

Edited July 15, 2015 by xmen

[Serif The Sheriff 73]

That was the problem in the first place you could camp a corner and freeze peek people without them being able to do anything...

Ok, well if that would still be too strong then alright, I just wanted to see what other people thought. I always thought the two main issues with it were the lift which I know is fixed and the fact that it drew the line to people and on the server I was told the change to LOS was just because of the line.

[turbulance 105]

welcome back Seriff >.>

[Serif The Sheriff 73]

welcome back Seriff >.>

You know you guys missed me lol

[HCMikey 248]

What the fuck? he actually made a thread about it. I was being sarcastic dude.

[Name 2616]

well you see, night elf had way too strong early game laning power, especially against AD carries, so we wanted to bring him in line with other assassins while not dramatically altering his playstyle

[Serif The Sheriff 73]

What the fuck? he actually made a thread about it. I was being sarcastic dude.

Uh, this was also after talking to Face about it because I was curious about what caused the change in the first place. Other than being told that it was changed because of the lines, my decision to ask about this had nothing to do with the conversation that was had on the server. Jesus Christ.

[Iherdcows 3419]

I've always like serif. Also hornycat why harass him? He as nothing but respectful 

[HCMikey 248]

I've always like serif. Also hornycat why harass him? He as nothing but respectful

Wait wut? I'm not harassing him. I'm one of the few who actually likes the dude, He is one of the funner guys on the servers. I just think it's funny that at any moment, serif will actually turn into a night elf

Edited July 16, 2015 by HornyCat

[Serif The Sheriff 73]

Wait wut? I'm not harassing him. I'm one fo the few who actually likes the dude, He is one of the funner guys on the servers. I just think it's funny that at any moment, serif will actually turn into a night elf

Lol, if only dude. If only

[Knox 1470]

lol

[skitt 1307]

this change made it a direct counter to knife races, instead of being the entangle that night elf has had since wcs first existed. It was quite a nerf, and I actually disagree with it. I think roots should have been dealt with in another manner, such as increasing the cooldown. Night elf is still strong, just not as strong as it used to be by indirectly nerfing roots against gun races. 

 

serif, i really wanted to post a lot of rage when i heard you made yet another thread about night elf.

 

so fuck you

[Face 1910]

Just for general knowledge, not stating an opinion either way:

 

Night elf has the 2nd highest KD of the starter races (1.2 to Humans 1.6, Undeads 1.1, and Orcs 0.9) and is the second most played race on the server.

 

(These numbers come from the last 30 days)

[Serif The Sheriff 73]

serif, i really wanted to post a lot of rage when i heard you made yet another thread about night elf.

 

so fuck you

Well be glad that I wasn't raging in this one or being excessively crazy about it like I used to. NE just happened to be one of the first races I played since being back and I was just curious about what happened with it. I figured that since the post was done in a more civil manner than I used to that it wouldn't be a big deal, but I guess I was wrong lol

[Rayne 4478]

That was the problem in the first place you could camp a corner and freeze peek people without them being able to do anything...

 

Edit: and so it begins... :|

Judge is still able to do this though... Yes it's restricted to the UMP but it's still just as OP. NE has gone from my favourite race to near bottom now purely because of LoS. Fully agree the green line was OP but just removing that and leaving the circle graphics around the player would be enough of a nerf to balance it.

[Name 2616]

this change made it a direct counter to knife races, instead of being the entangle that night elf has had since wcs first existed. It was quite a nerf, and I actually disagree with it. I think roots should have been dealt with in another manner, such as increasing the cooldown. Night elf is still strong, just not as strong as it used to be by indirectly nerfing roots against gun races. 

 

serif, i really wanted to post a lot of rage when i heard you made yet another thread about night elf.

 

so fuck you

 

this change made it a direct counter to knife races, instead of being the entangle that night elf has had since wcs first existed. It was quite a nerf, and I actually disagree with it. I think roots should have been dealt with in another manner, such as increasing the cooldown. Night elf is still strong, just not as strong as it used to be by indirectly nerfing roots against gun races. 

 

serif, i really wanted to post a lot of rage when i heard you made yet another thread about night elf.

 

so fuck you

 

this change made it a direct counter to knife races, instead of being the entangle that night elf has had since wcs first existed. It was quite a nerf, and I actually disagree with it. I think roots should have been dealt with in another manner, such as increasing the cooldown. Night elf is still strong, just not as strong as it used to be by indirectly nerfing roots against gun races. 

 

serif, i really wanted to post a lot of rage when i heard you made yet another thread about night elf.

 

so fuck you

 

this change made it a direct counter to knife races, instead of being the entangle that night elf has had since wcs first existed. It was quite a nerf, and I actually disagree with it. I think roots should have been dealt with in another manner, such as increasing the cooldown. Night elf is still strong, just not as strong as it used to be by indirectly nerfing roots against gun races. 

 

serif, i really wanted to post a lot of rage when i heard you made yet another thread about night elf.

 

so fuck you

 

this change made it a direct counter to knife races, instead of being the entangle that night elf has had since wcs first existed. It was quite a nerf, and I actually disagree with it. I think roots should have been dealt with in another manner, such as increasing the cooldown. Night elf is still strong, just not as strong as it used to be by indirectly nerfing roots against gun races. 

 

serif, i really wanted to post a lot of rage when i heard you made yet another thread about night elf.

 

so fuck you

Entangle is still very effective against gun races, if you entangle someone who's moving even slightly their aim is put to shit and they hold perfectly still for you. I'd say this is effective to nerf against both gun and knife races without making it useless.

[Swed 2651]

Entangle is still very effective against gun races, if you entangle someone who's moving even slightly their aim is put to shit and they hold perfectly still for you. I'd say this is effective to nerf against both gun and knife races without making it useless.

Entangle is still very effective against gun races, if you entangle someone who's moving even slightly their aim is put to shit and they hold perfectly still for you. I'd say this is effective to nerf against both gun and knife races without making it useless.

Entangle is still very effective against gun races, if you entangle someone who's moving even slightly their aim is put to shit and they hold perfectly still for you. I'd say this is effective to nerf against both gun and knife races without making it useless.

Entangle is still very effective against gun races, if you entangle someone who's moving even slightly their aim is put to shit and they hold perfectly still for you. I'd say this is effective to nerf against both gun and knife races without making it useless.

I agree with Name's analysis Edited July 18, 2015 by Swed

[Destin 1958]

I agree with Name's analysis

 

I agree with Name's analysis

 

I agree with Name's analysis

 

I agree with Name's analysis

 

I agree with Name's analysis

This is aids

[Serif The Sheriff 73]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Entangle is still very effective against gun races, if you entangle someone who's moving even slightly their aim is put to shit and they hold perfectly still for you. I'd say this is effective to nerf against both gun and knife races without making it useless.

 

Either way shouldn't NE and Judge have the same kind of entangle? If NE's entangle is too strong because it can hit through walls and kind of gives wallhacks because of the line then isn't Judge's entangle just as OP for the same reason? I am not understanding why one had to change but not the other. I think both should be a radial thing without requiring LOS and the tracer line should get removed that way it can be used for makeshift wallhacks.

[Name 2616]

Either way shouldn't NE and Judge have the same kind of entangle? If NE's entangle is too strong because it can hit through walls and kind of gives wallhacks because of the line then isn't Judge's entangle just as OP for the same reason? I am not understanding why one had to change but not the other. I think both should be a radial thing without requiring LOS and the tracer line should get removed that way it can be used for makeshift wallhacks.

I considered that but I also decided that by nerfing them in different directions (Judge's entangle had its duration nerfed in the same patch) that they'd have a bit of flava to each one.

[Serif The Sheriff 73]

I considered that but I also decided that by nerfing them in different directions (Judge's entangle had its duration nerfed in the same patch) that they'd have a bit of flava to each one.

Ah ok.

[Serif The Sheriff 73]

Ok seriously, we need to change the NE entangle back and just remove the tracer line. I am supposed to only be able to entangle people if I can see them, but if I see them through a door, or a window, or if they are above me but standing on a grated floor, or on Westwood and Aztec if they are on the plank walkways even though I can clearly see them I still can't root them because the way the game is coded it says my view is obstructed by all of those objects. I don't care if the Judge entangle got the duration reduced, it's still just as OP because of the wallhacks it gives you and it's stupid that NE has to be a LOS which still doesn't always work because of dumb obstructions like windows and grates while Judge runs around with the way stronger version of roots. Please just make both of them radial things without the tracer line, that would fix everything.

[Face 1910]

If judges entangle is so much better just play judge. Its two different races tho so it is a moot point. Like night elf has better evade than some races.

I don't know about the doors/window thing but shit ain't happening for a few days. The kd is fine and the race is fine you really just don't like that its "different" than before. I don't really see much of a reason to change it myself and no one else has really mirrored your concerns (much the opposite really, people enjoy not getting 100% rekt while at the same time it still serves its purpose of pooping on fast races and Knifers)

[xmen 983]

If judges entangle is so much better just play judge. Its two different races tho so it is a moot point. Like night elf has better evade than some races.

I don't know about the doors/window thing but shit ain't happening for a few days. The kd is fine and the race is fine you really just don't like that its "different" than before. I don't really see much of a reason to change it myself and no one else has really mirrored your concerns (much the opposite really, people enjoy not getting 100% rekt while at the same time it still serves its purpose of pooping on fast races and Knifers)

nelf still op pls nerf